Good luck

First of all forgive my poor English, I’m spanish. I was a bit tired of the Stomper launch sequence too, but I must be pragmatic:

I think a pre-launch really works, maybe a certain group of people like us is starting to be more reticent because we are subscribed to the same group of “guru lists” and when a little time passes we see how they tend to become very similar, how sooner or later they use the same tactics.

We are developing some kind of “alarm” that early detects when a marketing tactic is trying to affect us (scarcity, “proven” headlines, almost identical pre-launch sequences…) but for the great masses, (those what matters for the money), it works.

I know that “common people” is not an “Infomation junkie” as I am and is not susbcribed to dozens of lists, so they are not over-exposed and they don’t develop the “inmunity” to that marketing tactics. If people use that kind of techniques is simply because it works in the great numbers…

In my country, Spain, Internet Business is light years after english speaking countries, and frankly, product launches are totally unknown, probably if someone makes some with a bit of knowledge and planification it should be strike hard because is an unknown technique and none has developed an antibody for that tactic.

So maybe we that write here are a bit tired, it’s a side effect in “information seekers” that the people behind theses strategies know that’s happening, but they don’t care very much, because it works for the rest of the people, the great mass that buys…

I do have BFM though and I like it a lot, especially the software.

The two programs are more complimentary than competitive. There is a slight overlap in the product launch discussion but they really are completely different products. You buy BFM to build a viral membership site and you product launch techniques to launch it.

If you had the cash available for both the logical sequence is to first plan what you are going to sell/market, buy PFL, study it and then put product into BFM. During the launch though BFM goes hand in hand with the PLF techniques you would use.

The PLF is for getting the sales and what to do before launch. Butterfly Marketing is how to build your product to continually produce income for you.

Both products intersect in a lot of spaces. PLF is basically do this 1.2.3. BM is build this, and keep making sales this way.

From what I can tell, both products are worth having, but my inclination is to build my first product, get PLF and use that to sell it, and then once I have the income from that to buy BM and use that for subsequent projects.

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As for unsubscribing from the guru lists, I do aprpeciate the education in seeing how they do their launches and what they are selling and such, but I just do not have the time to deal with all the spam or to read variations on the same sales pitch for something that I am not going to buy or market.

I plan on resubscribing in the future when I am needing new info, but right now I need to buckle down and actually produce something rather than just try to educate myself about something.

There are also other products that touch on it including Mike Filsaime’s Butterfly Marketing Manuscript (review here) .

What Storyboard formula are you referring to above?

Fred

My point is, all selling is psychological, it’s all emotional. When we are sold to our perception is being manipulated, our emotions are being massaged to the point where we will buy, be it a sugary fizzy drink, an Italian red sports car or an Internet marketing ebook.

The only problem I have is when the product is bad then we should be able to tell. I don’t use stompernet because I don’t think it’s for me. But that does not mean that others will not benefit. A focused, closed foum like they have could be rich in info. Unlike anarchic places like Digital Point where you have to dig hard for the nuggets.

I think it’s easy to get a bit snooty over how some products are sold. Personally I am more worried about the quality of the product than the sales technique.

I like most people here are online to make money, as long as we sell worthwhile products that are what we say they are I don’t see the problem.

If you find the hype tiring it probably means you are not the target audience. I find the hype around Nike trainers tiring too, I think people who buy into the emotional sales technique of the top brands are crazy. But then I am not in the target market.

The soft sell of the multinationals can be just as insidious as a hyped up ebook creator. At least with the ebook guy you know you’re being sold to.

I must say there is quite the varied opinions out there on product launches.

Some people love them because they are so effective at making sales. In this case it’s the outcome that really counts and they see a product launch as a fantastic formula for maximizing outcomes – sales. If this is indeed the sole purpose of marketing then it is hard to argue against this point of view.

Some find the process powerful as a marketing tool but find the hype tiring, regardless of how effective it might be on a certain group of consumers to product sales. I think I’m in this group – it’s hard to ignore the sales results, yet I don’t want to be a purveyor of that kind of hype. Then again, defining what a person considers hype is difficult – when I write a sales letter that I don’t consider over the top another person may consider it extremely hypey, it’s very hard to qualify.

I think it’s possible to be successful and not use excessive emotional manipulation, but then again I’ve never done it to the degree of success that the top Internet marketers who use product launch have, so I’m not really offering any proof to back up my point of view. Maybe hype really is the only way to get big results.

Lastly there are those people who just flat out hate the product launch process and will boycott those who use it complaining of excessive hype, emotional manipulation and all kinds of awful things.

It’s just like I want to be able to go shopping without every clerk in the store being like a cheap used car saleman with endless pitches and emotionally manipulative closing tactics.

If that’s what you call “marketing” then, I don’t want to be “in marketing” either I guess.

To me marketing is what companies like Apple or Starbucks do. I’d call these launches more like credit card seductions.

That said, theirs has been, by far, the best launch I’ve witnessed since Jeff Walker’s PLF came out. I’ve been tiring of the report+blog+launch formula in the IM industry, and I think marketers are going to have to step things up a notch/come up with some innovations when marketing to other marketers, as it’s obvious simply from the comments above mine that some of these tactics aren’t as effective anymore.

Outside the IM market, they seem to work quite well – I had an April launch that used PLF elements and was blown away by the results it produced, as well as the long-term relationship it helped build with my customers. Good stuff.

Anyway, for those who aren’t wanting to see “hype” or receive affiliate offers along with their “content rich” newsletter subscriptions, this *really* is the wrong industry to be in. Seriously – you want to be in marketing but are offended when marketed to? I don’t get it.

That was an excellent post you did on the “8 pitfalls to avoid when starting an internet business.”

I was one of those who was almost suckered by Andy and Brad into the ridiculously high price of $800/mo for what is pretty much just general SEO. They could have culled the herd a lot easier if they just released the price ahead of time. Instead, they made desperate people believe they could get rich for less than $1000. It’s sick really. You should see some of the letters I’ve received from people who were ready to spend their last dollar on these false hopes, and then they are crushed when they realize they were deceived right up to the ‘buy’ button, when they see they can’t afford it. Touching stuff.

It got me so upset I started a site that myself and a bunch of other concerned people will be evolving over the next short while.

http://www.SEOGuruBusters.com

Hopefully, exposing all these hypsters will bring awareness to the market to help make it a more business-like and professional offering.

Thanks again, excellent work here. We’ll definitely be referring to you on our new site – an excellent resource.

Regards,

Paul

Personally i think that launches like this cheapen the percieved value of a system that Andy and Brad are offering making it harder for skeptical people to buy until word of mouth kicks in on a personal level from a networking contact who swears by andy and brad’s system. Till then i find it hard to truly see the value of buying something like this.

Being hit with daily hype is standard but it holds me back from buying such products.

Luc

As you mention – the real opportunity is to apply it outside of IM space.

Something that IS a problem though, the underlying assumption and reliance that people have a valuable product or service to market as part of these launches.

Many aspects of the launch (testimonials, proof, strong message to market match) all depend on having done exceptional strategic planning, soul searching and market research.

Unfortunately, I see many people purchasing package after package based on the hype and NOT having a solid business upon which to market.

Great article by the way!

Jeff

I am increasing the number of “guru” email lists. Don’t you hate the word guru? I always see the person meditating with a bong and saying things like. “The way of Internet Marketing is the way of the swallow with an empty belly.”

I love this stuff, I love all this being sold to. Why? because most of these dudes are making buckets of cash and that’s why I’m here, well that and Scorcese kept returning my scripts.

I’m keeping my subscriptions because I want to know what these guys are upto, you have to keep plugged in, things in the industry change so fast. Get in on the next new thing early and you can ride that sweet wave all the way.

It’s the same with copywriting, it’s easy to say I’m sick of the 22pt, bright red lettering. Thing is, it works and I’m not online to be Hemmingway.

No I wont be buying Stomper, it’s way too expensive, you are better off spending the money going to a real conference and networking with real people.

I only had time to scan the stuff and the sales letter did not bite me, probably because it wasn’t aimed at me.

Nor any of you other guys, which maybe is why it jarred. But I wanna know what these guys are upto because they have what I want to have.

There is only so much time in the day to ingest all the info around, which makes time management and focus – two things which I am terrible at even though I write about it – more important.

I’m not saying read everything, buy everything. But you gotta keep your ears to the ground. Know whose doing what and what’s the latest thing cooking.

In the end you have to do the work to create a site and get traffic. Just because something is working for me doesn’t mean that other people will benefit following the same steps.

The total pre-meditation of these things really gets on my nerves. e.g. “The servers are crashing….we had to take the sales page down…”.

But I don’t doubt that it’s an effective strategy – the Brad and Andy one seems to have gone pretty well anyway.

You make a great point about taking the product launch strategy offline. Done well, I have no doubt that it would have the effectiveness of an atom bomb…just like the internet ones did when they started.

It’s just been getting a bit rediculous lately with the sheer number of launches and the sheer number of people launching the EXACT same thing.

The problem with the internet marketing niche is that you wind up on all the same lists because that’s where the good stuff is, at first. However, once the good stuff in the autoresponder is gone, then you are stuck with the affiliate marketing that comes after.

I just don’t have time anymore. I’ll just keep unsubscribing and then resubscribe when I find a new need to educate myself about.